Re: Amal in Texas this afternoon 15.11.16

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 18:19

party animal - not! wrote:As somebody who used to work with the media I can tell you that one of the most powerful people on the planet in this area is Rupert Murdoch who owns Fox, Sky, The Times, The Sun, Fox/Paramount.....I could go on.

I understand that most of his shareholders are Republican and many of them were more interested in their own wealth than anything else i e they did not want to vote anyone in who would raise their undoubtedly low taxes and hit their already well-stuffed pockets...........never mind a reluctance to vote in a woman!

I cannot wait to see how George does with Hack Attack which lifts the lid on what Murdoch and his companies have done over the years......

U.S. Oil/Corporate business can always manipulate the tax system to work in their favor.

Fox, NBC, CBS, ABC, CNN all have corporate affiliates with financial interest in Syria and their surrounding countries. Hillary’s pledge to relocate Syrian refugees clearly shows she is willing to work with their agenda.

We in the United States understand our government has checks and balances. Any proposals made by Trump will be checked against constitutional and international laws.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 18:45

annemarie wrote:Yes she will she will be doing her job, which has nothing to do with Trump.

I would think the U.N Security counsel is very aware of Trumps violations.

Amal is the one who brought Trump’s proposals into her work as a Human Rights Lawyer.

Trump’s proposals are just that, proposals. What’s alarming to me is using any platform to express violations regarding proposals that has yet to go through our vetting process.

More alarming is the possibility U.S. Oil/Corporate Business use an international platform and their influence to avert the established rules that govern the Electoral College.

by party animal - not! Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:04

So who are these corporate affilliates? Busy doing research on this............

by Donnamarie Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:05

Big business/corporations/banks are optimistic and supporting Trump's victory for the most part. Look at how the stock market rallied after Trump won last week. They see their tax rates being significantly reduced and Dodd-Frank possibly being repealed. The Republican Congress will certainly be more than happy to pass tax cuts for the rich and reduce as many business regulations as they can get away with. I'm sure they are concerned about his true lack of inexperience and knowledge in governing and his possible volatility in dealing with foreign leaders. But otherwise I think they see Trump's Presidency as a positive.

And BTW this idea that there are forces trying to fix the Electoral College or incite conflict regarding this election sounds conspiratorial in nature and I just don't buy it.

by annemarie Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:14

Amal said the proposals are against human rights so they fit into what she was speaking about about.

She also said we have to hope for the best and everyone has to respect the outcome of the democratic process here.

by LizzyNY Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:31

Considering the people Trump is gathering around him and the appointments he is making, hoping for the best is fast fading as an option. People who recognize fascism when they see it (and we ARE seeing it NOW) need to do anything and everything to let Trump know that we will not let him get away with turning us into a fascist dictatorship. Contact every government official you can - from local to federal level - and let them know you want them to fight him tooth and nail.

He is NOT going to suddenly turn into a mature, thoughtful, intelligent adult. He is what he is: a dangerous, entitled, racist, misogynistic sociopath and an embarrassment to our country.

by annemarie Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:39

Lizzy he will never change he is exactly what he portrayed himself to be during the campaign. I was hoping for the best but the people he wants to work for him are not a good thing for our country.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:48

party animal - not! wrote:So who are these corporate affilliates? Busy doing research on this............

Very easy to find just look up any media outlet, you will find the corporate base the fall under.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 19:59

LizzyNY wrote:Considering the people Trump is gathering around him and the appointments he is making, hoping for the best is fast fading as an option. People who recognize fascism when they see it (and we ARE seeing it NOW) need to do anything and everything to let Trump know that we will not let him get away with turning us into a fascist dictatorship. Contact every government official you can - from local to federal level - and let them know you want them to fight him tooth and nail.

He is NOT going to suddenly turn into a mature, thoughtful, intelligent adult. He is what he is: a dangerous, entitled, racist, misogynistic sociopath and an embarrassment to our country.

By all accounts U.S. Oil/Corporate Business will do anything they can including using their influence to avert the Electoral College.

Fascism is the least of our concerns. Remember it was a 14 year seated Conservative Republican U.S. Supreme court that redefined marriage and did not hear one case in 14 years regarding abortion.

You seem to not understand we have a government with checks and balances.

by LizzyNY Fri 18 Nov 2016, 20:15

Ladybug - I DO understand that we have a government with checks and balances. Donald Trump DOES NOT. He is bringing people into his administration who will change what they can legally and circumvent the law to change the rest in order to get what they want. They don't give a damn about checks and balances.

You and I have very different ideas about what is important for the future of our country. The last thing I'm worried about is other people's sex lives or what they do with their own bodies.

by Fingersandtoes Fri 18 Nov 2016, 20:18

Fascism is least of the worries? Really?!?

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 20:47

Donnamarie wrote:Big business/corporations/banks are optimistic and supporting Trump's victory for the most part. Look at how the stock market rallied after Trump won last week. They see their tax rates being significantly reduced and Dodd-Frank possibly being repealed. The Republican Congress will certainly be more than happy to pass tax cuts for the rich and reduce as many business regulations as they can get away with. I'm sure they are concerned about his true lack of inexperience and knowledge in governing and his possible volatility in dealing with foreign leaders. But otherwise I think they see Trump's Presidency as a positive.

And BTW this idea that there are forces trying to fix the Electoral College or incite conflict regarding this election sounds conspiratorial in nature and I just don't buy it.

Don't let appearances fool you; I’ve learned appearances are used to foster deception.

You have to also look at the opposition that has played out in the media against Trump. I have followed the actions of Big Business and the Conservative Right for a very long time. I know there are reasons why the “Republican Party” do not want to take hold of this presidential term in office.

They NEVER expected Trump to win. Big Business are very capable of “setting up” factors to be use as reasons to avert the Electoral College. The media coverage of protest, electronic petitions, and the citing of human rights violations... are ALL factors that have continued to play out in media (TV, Internet and print) regarding this election.

Very interesting for Amal, a person VERY invested in this election to speak at an international platform regarding Trump’s proposals just days before the Electoral College is to vote.

I hope you are correct and my thoughts are just an unreal conspiracy theory.

by Fingersandtoes Fri 18 Nov 2016, 20:54

Trumps proposals need to be spoken about. Letting him do it all and keeping quiet would be wrong. The press are already bending backwards normalising his hate speech. People act more offended that trump is being called a racist, than the racism itself. The more people stand up to his hate and racism, the better. The more public platform, the better.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 21:04

LizzyNY wrote:Ladybug - I DO understand that we have a government with checks and balances. Donald Trump DOES NOT. He is bringing people into his administration who will change what they can legally and circumvent the law to change the rest in order to get what they want. They don't give a damn about checks and balances.

You and I have very different ideas about what is important for the future of our country. The last thing I'm worried about is other people's sex lives or what they do with their own bodies.

You have the right to believe Trump can circumvent our entire system of government. I don't.

What people do with their own bodies is their own business. When they use their way of life to redefine institution that is structured to define all of us human: male/female is where I take a stand.

Lizzy we clearly are not going to agree on the majority Conservative Republican United States Supreme Court and their mandate to redefine the institution that defines human existence. I welcome the conversation and extend my hand to agree to disagree.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 21:05

Fingersandtoes wrote:Trumps proposals need to be spoken about. Letting him do it all and keeping quiet would be wrong. The press are already bending backwards normalising his hate speech. People act more offended that trump is being called a racist, than the racism itself. The more people stand up to his hate and racism, the better. The more public platform, the better.

That seems to be the plan.

by Fingersandtoes Fri 18 Nov 2016, 21:09

ladybugcngc wrote:
Fingersandtoes wrote:Trumps proposals need to be spoken about. Letting him do it all and keeping quiet would be wrong. The press are already bending backwards normalising his hate speech. People act more offended that trump is being called a racist, than the racism itself. The more people stand up to his hate and racism, the better. The more public platform, the better.

That seems to be the plan.

Good. Hope it works!

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 21:42

annemarie wrote:Amal said the proposals are against human rights so they fit into what she was speaking about about.

She also said we have to hope for the best and everyone has to respect the outcome of the democratic process here.

annemarie wrote: “ Yes she will she will be doing her job, which has nothing to do with Trump”

ladybug response: You can’t separate Trump from his proposals.

I understand Amal Clooney has a vested interest in this election.

Let’s hope when Amal speaks of respecting the outcome of the democratic process does not include the Republican Party circumventing the rules that has governed the Electoral College over the last 200 years.

by Donnamarie Fri 18 Nov 2016, 22:00

Civil and human rights groups are going to have their work cut out for them for the next four years .. .that is if Trump lasts that long. We can hope that he will get kicked out of office.

Just look at some of the people he has already selected for Cabinet positions. At the very least we are all in for a bumpy ride.

Unlike some media commentators have suggested I will not be hitting the reset button on this man. i hope Americans who really care about a just America will not become complacent and allow him and the Republican Congress to take us backwards on the progress we have made in civil, human and religious rights.

by ladybugcngc Fri 18 Nov 2016, 22:33

Donnamarie wrote:Civil and human rights groups are going to have their work cut out for them for the next four years .. .that is if Trump lasts that long. We can hope that he will get kicked out of office.

Just look at some of the people he has already selected for Cabinet positions. At the very least we are all in for a bumpy ride.

Unlike some media commentators have suggested I will not be hitting the reset button on this man. i hope Americans who really care about a just America will not become complacent and allow him and the Republican Congress to take us backwards on the progress we have made in civil, human and religious rights.

We have to first get past the Electoral College.

by LizzyNY Sat 19 Nov 2016, 00:44

Ladybug - I don't understand your fears about the Electoral College. It is an anachronism that we would be better off without, but all it really does is register the votes pledged by each state to each candidate. Nothing Amal or anyone else says is going to change the votes, as each elector is pledged to vote the way his/her state directs - and that is based on the popular vote in that state.

I also don't understand why you think Amal has more invested in this election than the rest of us, unless it is because of her work in the area of human rights. If that's the case, she's not the only one who should be very concerned - we all should be.

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 01:33

LizzyNY wrote:Ladybug - I don't understand your fears about the Electoral College. It is an anachronism that we would be better off without, but all it really does is register the votes pledged by each state to each candidate. Nothing Amal or anyone else says is going to change the votes, as each elector is pledged to vote the way his/her state directs - and that is based on the popular vote in that state.

I also don't understand why you think Amal has more invested in this election than the rest of us, unless it is because of her work in the area of human rights. If that's the case, she's not the only one who should be very concerned - we all should be.

Lizzy - In a post responding to Donna I explained in great detail my concerns.
I explain my concerns about Big Business and the Conservative Right.
I listed factors the Republican Party may use as a reason to circumvent the Electoral College vote.
I explained my concerns about Amal Clooney’s citing violations associated with Trumps proposals.
In a post to Annemarie I spoke about Amal’s statement regarding the democratic process.
I need to know what you don’t understand.

Lizzy quote: “I also don't understand why you think Amal has more invested in this election than the rest of us, unless it is because of her work in the area of human rights. If that's the case, she's not the only one who should be very concerned - we all should be”.
Response: Hosting a 15 million dollar fundraiser for Hilliary, involvement in the relocation of Syrian refugee, and speaking before an international platform regarding violations associated with Trump’s proposals that have NOT been vetted by our system of government are just a few reasons why I continue to speak about Amal’s vested interest in this election.

by LizzyNY Sat 19 Nov 2016, 01:53

Ladybug - I understand your concerns about big business and the conservative right. What I don't understand is how you connect it to Republicans and the Electoral College. I also don't understand how it would benefit the Republican party to "circumvent" the Electoral College vote - let alone how they would do it.

As far as Amal is concerned, I don't see how she is any more vested in what Trump does than the rest of us. We all will be affected by any policies he comes up with, whether they are constitutional or not. As far as the fundraiser is concerned, it's a non-starter. Guaranteed that was all on George, as he has been a Clinton supporter for years and it wasn't the first time he raised money for Democratic candidates.

by Donnamarie Sat 19 Nov 2016, 03:52

ladybug, you wrote "Don't let appearances fool you. I've learned appearances are used to foster deception."

You also seem to think the media is rigged ... bought and paid for by big business. You don't believe what they report. This position of yours speaks to conspiracy theories. I can't argue the points you are making based on this. I don't believe in any of them. During this campaign there were lots of conspiracy theories about Hillary Clinton. Many of them have been circulating for years. Theories put forth by the alt right. Pretty wretched stuff IMO. I have no use for talk like that. I deal in facts. I believe in my government, messy as it is, and I generally believe main stream media. If you can't trust and believe in the basic institutions in our country who can you believe?

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 04:25

Donnamarie wrote:ladybug, you wrote "Don't let appearances fool you. I've learned appearances are used to foster deception."

You also seem to think the media is rigged ... bought and paid for by big business. You don't believe what they report. This position of yours speaks to conspiracy theories. I can't argue the points you are making based on this. I don't believe in any of them. During this campaign there were lots of conspiracy theories about Hillary Clinton. Many of them have been circulating for years. Theories put forth by the alt right. Pretty wretched stuff IMO. I have no use for talk like that. I deal in facts. I believe in my government, messy as it is, and I generally believe main stream media. If you can't trust and believe in the basic institutions in our country who can you believe?

Donna I completely understand your position. Let's talk about it after the Electoral College vote.

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 04:59

LizzyNY wrote:Ladybug - I understand your concerns about big business and the conservative right. What I don't understand is how you connect it to Republicans and the Electoral College. I also don't understand how it would benefit the Republican party to "circumvent" the Electoral College vote - let alone how they would do it.

As far as Amal is concerned, I don't see how she is any more vested in what Trump does than the rest of us. We all will be affected by any policies he comes up with, whether they are constitutional or not. As far as the fundraiser is concerned, it's a non-starter. Guaranteed that was all on George, as he has been a Clinton supporter for years and it wasn't the first time he raised money for Democratic candidates.

Because the republican candidate won the electoral college it would take the "Republican Party" to urge the Electorate to change their vote.

There are various reasons why I don't the think the Republican Party want to be responsible for this presidential term. The fact the Republican Party did nothing to remove Trump before the primaries should give you a clue.

To be honest I think Trump was humbled by his win. I can only hope he will keep his commitment to stand for all people. I respect your opinions regarding Amal. The truth is the fundraiser was listed as co-host. If the fundraiser was George Clooney only and he chose to speak before the UN Security Council days before the Electoral College votes I would have the same firm opinion.

by Fingersandtoes Sat 19 Nov 2016, 05:04

If trump speaks about something during his presidential campaign trail, of course people are going to speak about it. He wants to be the US oresident, and he skated around 'punshing' women for abortions. That's alarming, and should be talked about. His proposals about having muslim citizens to register, thats alarming, and should be talked about. His fence on the border of Mexico, should be talked about. Why should people wait until the government okays the proposals?

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 05:07

Fingersandtoes wrote:If trump speaks about something during his presidential campaign trail, of course people are going to speak about it. He wants to be the US oresident, and he skated around 'punshing' women for abortions. That's alarming, and should be talked about. His proposals about having muslim citizens to register, thats alarming, and should be talked about. His fence on the border of Mexico, should be talked about. Why should people wait until the government okays the proposals?

Interesting...

by LizzyNY Sat 19 Nov 2016, 13:56

ladybugcngc wrote:Because the republican candidate won the electoral college it would take the "Republican Party" to urge the Electorate to change their vote.

1. How would the Republican Party get the Electoral College to change the result of the election to make Hillary the winner?

There are various reasons why I don't the think the Republican Party want to be responsible for this presidential term. The fact the Republican Party did nothing to remove Trump before the primaries should give you a clue.

2. There are many reasons why nobody wants to be responsible for this presidential term. If it were possible for the Republicans to change the outcome of the Electoral College vote it would make Hillary our President. Then the Republicans would be killing themselves to get her out of office.

I respect your opinions regarding Amal. The truth is the fundraiser was listed as co-host. If the fundraiser was George Clooney only and he chose to speak before the UN Security Council days before the Electoral College votes I would have the same firm opinion.

3.    She was listed as co-host for the fundraiser because she is his wife and the dinner was being held in their home. It is common practice and common courtesy. Your insistence on placing some kind of sinister intent on the timing of her UN speech is baffling. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 15:22

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 15:28

Lizzy -1. How would the Republican Party get the Electoral College to change the result of the election to make Hillary the winner?

Ladybug - They are party members ask them.

Lizzy - 2. There are many reasons why nobody wants to be responsible for this presidential term. If it were possible for the Republicans to change the outcome of the Electoral College vote it would make Hillary our President. Then the Republicans would be killing themselves to get her out of office.

Ladybug - With Hillary as president they would still find ways to manipulate the system and they would still have control of the House and Senate.

Lizzy - 3. She was listed as co-host for the fundraiser because she is his wife and the dinner was being held in theirhome. It is common practice and common courtesy. Your insistence on placing some kind of sinister intent on the timing of her UN speech is baffling. One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Ladybug - Amal spoke about Hillary independently and severally of her husband. Example: if George Clooney was my husband even though I would respect his opinion, I would not be listed as a co-host because I’m not a Hillary supporter.
The conversation about the price of the ticket would go something like this Quarrel 1

;trust me I know George would win and I would be scratch

If Amal speaks about Trump’s proposals that have not been vetted by our system of government, at an international platform, before the Electoral College votes, understanding her vested interest in the outcome of this election, I would not only find it sinister, it would find it UNTHINKABLE.

by melbert Sat 19 Nov 2016, 16:17

ladybugcngc wrote:
Lizzy, you obviously don't know U.S. Oil/Corporate business like I know them; they run the news media TV, Internet, and print, They did not want Donald Trump to win this election. Because they CLEARLY have ran our government for the last 16 years they will do any and everything to get Trump removed including manipulating the Electorate.

Then Ladybug, please tell us all HOW Trump won then?

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 16:20

melbert wrote:
ladybugcngc wrote:
Lizzy, you obviously don't know U.S. Oil/Corporate business like I know them; they run the news media TV, Internet, and print, They did not want Donald Trump to win this election. Because they CLEARLY have ran our government for the last 16 years they will do any and everything to get Trump removed including manipulating the Electorate.

Then Ladybug, please tell us all HOW Trump won then?

The silent majority.

by melbert Sat 19 Nov 2016, 16:22

Interesting...

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 16:31

melbert wrote:Interesting...

by Fingersandtoes Sat 19 Nov 2016, 16:44

ladybugcngc wrote:
melbert wrote:
ladybugcngc wrote:
Lizzy, you obviously don't know U.S. Oil/Corporate business like I know them; they run the news media TV, Internet, and print, They did not want Donald Trump to win this election. Because they CLEARLY have ran our government for the last 16 years they will do any and everything to get Trump removed including manipulating the Electorate.

Then Ladybug, please tell us all HOW Trump won then?
The silent majority.

Actually he didn't win by the majority vote. silent or not silent.

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 17:32

Fingersandtoes wrote:
ladybugcngc wrote:
melbert wrote:
Then Ladybug, please tell us all HOW Trump won then?
The silent majority.
Actually he didn't win by the majority vote. silent or not silent.

Fingersandtoes, he won the election.

by LizzyNY Sat 19 Nov 2016, 17:34

He won the election because he got more votes in the Electoral College. Hillary won the popular vote by more than 1.2 MILLION votes. SHE got the majority of the national electorate's vote, not Trump.

by ladybugcngc Sat 19 Nov 2016, 18:15

LizzyNY wrote:He won the election because he got more votes in the Electoral College. Hillary won the popular vote by more than 1.2 MILLION votes. SHE got the majority of the national electorate's vote, not Trump.

Maybe a potluck with the silent majority would have helped her.

by PigPen Sat 19 Nov 2016, 18:34

Thought for the day ( IMHO)... Hilary Clinton, was first lady, senator and sec of state, lost to someone with no govt experience. What does that say about Hilary- other than ultimately she wasn't the people's choice. But to use one of her favorite excuses... maybe it was a conspiracy.

Getting back on topic ....Amal in Tx.....I could care less about what she has to say about American politics. And to be completely honest- if her last name wasn't Clooney- I don't think I'd be alone in my opinion.

by LizzyNY Sat 19 Nov 2016, 20:13

Sorry, PP, but as the popular vote continues to be counted it appears that Hillary WAS the people's choice - by more than 1 million votes. She didn't lose he election, she lost the vote in the Electoral College. If we had direct election by popular vote she would be president.

by party animal - not! Sat 19 Nov 2016, 20:33

How galling must that be? I cannot imagine how it must feel.

Who designed the system? A bloke, no doubt.

PS Noted that one Rupert Murdoch was a visitor to the Trump thingy yesterday...........

by Donnamarie Sat 19 Nov 2016, 21:19

party animal - not! wrote:How galling must that be? I cannot imagine how it must feel.

Who designed the system? A bloke, no doubt.

PS Noted that one Rupert Murdoch was a visitor to the Trump thingy yesterday...........

Actually PAN you're right. But it was about seven blokes who came up with the Electoral College during our Constitutional Convention way back in 1787. This is the fifth time a presidential candidate lost the electoral college but won the popular vote.

by ladybugcngc Sun 20 Nov 2016, 06:48

Donnamarie wrote:ladybug, you wrote "Don't let appearances fool you. I've learned appearances are used to foster deception."

You also seem to think the media is rigged ... bought and paid for by big business. You don't believe what they report. This position of yours speaks to conspiracy theories. I can't argue the points you are making based on this. I don't believe in any of them. During this campaign there were lots of conspiracy theories about Hillary Clinton. Many of them have been circulating for years. Theories put forth by the alt right. Pretty wretched stuff IMO. I have no use for talk like that. I deal in facts. I believe in my government, messy as it is, and I generally believe main stream media. If you can't trust and believe in the basic institutions in our country who can you believe?

I saw this article, I think you might find it interesting. The News media build-up begins. I find the title of the article extremely interesting.

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by PigPen Mon 21 Nov 2016, 20:14

LizzyNY wrote:Sorry, PP, but as the popular vote continues to be counted it appears that Hillary WAS the people's choice - by more than 1 million votes. She didn't lose he election, she lost the vote in the Electoral College. If we had direct election by popular vote she would be president.

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by party animal - not! Tue 29 Nov 2016, 17:18

A slightly bigger bit of her talk just released:

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by Joanna Tue 29 Nov 2016, 17:52

party animal - not! wrote:A slightly bigger bit of her talk just released:

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Thanks PAN......what a shame it was abruptly cut off !!

by Donnamarie Tue 29 Nov 2016, 17:56

Thanks for the link PAN. Too bad it got cut off before hearing more about Amal's passion for her work. Hopefully another snippet will show up on YouTube continuing the conversation.

by annemarie Tue 29 Nov 2016, 19:56

Thanks pan, I hope we get the full interview.

by carolhathaway Tue 29 Nov 2016, 21:35

So do I. It sounds really interesting.

by ladybugcngc Sat 17 Dec 2016, 15:08

party animal - not! wrote:Brilliant, Donnamarie! Hope you can join them

The Hollywood Reporter today

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She is addressing the UN Security Council on December 16th

was this canceled?

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